good more than i'm becky quick along with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin.more than i' quick along with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin. romney accused of president of diminishing american leadership during his first term. they discussed military spending, the middle east, china. and john harwood will join us with the highlights. among our newsmakers you can we have rob portman at 7:00. he's been playing the role of president obama in mitt romney's debate preparations. then coming up at 8:00, we have senator john kerry. he's been playing mitt romney in the president's debate prep sessions. of course earnings central is still in full swing. before the bell, we will hear from dupont, 3 m, united technologies, and many others. also a topic dominating

discussions is the fiscal cliff. the annual meeting of the securities trade group is taking place in new york today. and the looming risk the u.s. economy is sure to be on the agenda of participants. we'll be joined by a few of those this morning. including gary gensler. chet heick will also be joining us. on the lighter side of thing, we'll have a rock star among us this morning. yeah, we mean this literally. not just the rock stars we usually have. john popper of blues travelers will be joining us on set at 8:40 to talk about the business of music. but first, let's get over to joe. you have some breaking earnings news? >> i do. at about six numbers for dupont. i'll give you the one that is comparable to expectations. and that is 44 cents which is -- versus 46 cents for an estimate. but first the company said it posted a lot of a nickel from

continuing operations. then it said it was 32 cents excluding items. and then it said the bottom line was actually a penny, but excludeing everything, it was 44 crept cents. still two cents below expectations on lower than expected sales. 7.4 billion versus 8.15 billion is what was expected. now, for the rest of the year which as we know for a lot of these is only one more quarter, the company saying 325 to 330. and that is below the $3.93 estimate that we're looking for at this point. so dupont you might think would be in a position where forex and maybe a slowdown globally would certainly be seen in these shares. i can't tell, 85.08 was the

close, 84.20 was the bid and # 4.about 73 is the ask. the high and low on due month 1.16. been as high as almost 1.17 in the last year. and the low all the way down at 78. so we are much closer to the low for a dow component that is near a high. due monthpont nowhere near its . >> the chair and ceo making comments. she says weaker than expected demand contributed to the market. >> they have a lot of different products obviously. >> they talk about agriculture, too. sales were actually up 4%. if you look lieu some of the other numbers on this, volume declines in electronics communications and performance

chemicals were the biggest drops that they saw. makes you you wonder if china is a problem, too. >> that revenue number, i don't have a year ago figure. i wonder what the company earned a year ago. i wonder if that is actually a lower revenue number like we've seen on some of these companies recently. you can work on the bottom line, but you can't really hide from a revenue number. i got to go into the press release to actually see because i don't have -- >> a year ago for the quarter 9.23 billion. >> amazing. 7.4 billion in the current period. so that is what has ban one of the things that analysts have been talking about this time around that has been disappointing and one of the reasons that the market has started pulling back a little since last week when the earnings season really started in earnest and a lot of it has to do with revenue.

>> 5% lower volume, 1% net reduction. >> crappy. but the stock was 1.19. it's 84. so who knows whether there's any selling left in those shares. other headlines this morning, though. >> i think andrew has them. >> hi, guys. kind of weird to be standing right over here and you're right over there -- >> and i'm sort of looking at you like -- >> no computers to look at. >> they can see there. >> you look cool back there. an cr drew, do you know what today is? it's tuesday. we have two weeks. i'm not ready. i've got -- i'm not -- i want more of this -- >> are you kidding? >> yeah, i'm kidding. i just need more info. i'm leaning. i lean this way, i lean that way and then how i finally lean -- >> pinl decision will be made on that tuesday. >> i lean this way and that way and then you know how i feinall lean? forward as i rise above. what's going on?

>> yahoo! reporting better than expected third quarter earnings. revenues were in line in her first conference call marissa mayer promise to go make them more smartphone friendly. >> yahoo! hasn't capitalized on the mobile opportunity. we haven't effectively optimized our website. we've underinvested in our mobile front end development. and we've splintered or brands. we have more than 76 applications across android and ios. all of this needs to change. our top priority is a focused coherent mobile strategy. >> shares of yahoo! rising in after hours trading. she has a lot of work ahead of her. we'll talk to an analyst about how extensive that work might be. texas instruments earnings and revenue topping consensus did despite a drop in demand. guidance weak. forecasting more weakness in quarter in all of it customer

segments. company warning that customers are ordering fewer chips than expected for this time of year as they are nervous about weekend market demand. and apple set to make a big product announcement. we'll bring to you you. it is widely expected to be the smallest cheaper version of the ipad. coming called the ipad mini. we don't know. cnbc will have complete coverage of course of that event. and we have monday moone who aro watch. facebook reporting quarterly results after the bell. that now if officially less than half of -- $19.50. officially less than half of what it was when it came to market. mr. kernen. >> now back to last night's debate, john harwood was there. he joins us there boca raton with the highlights. i need an exhe thin extension. i don't know if i can decide. you know what, it's 47 and 47.

i'm so sick of these six percent in the middle that can't seem -- they don't know yet, john, really? i mean, they don't know after all this it's the 6% that we're going through billions of dollars trying to convince them? the other thing i was thinking of, we are going to be no matter who win as divided country. i saw yesterday in your poll, white men, 33% lead for romney. and then you got women all voting for the president. no one's going to be married after this. we'll be getting divorces. >> 4 4% lead for obama with hispanics. >> no one will like anyone after this, john. are you going to bring us together? >> joe, on the extension part, if you're still voting absentee from ohio, the obama campaign would be happy for you to think about it all the way through november and maybe vote early december. >> are you going to be ready for this in two weeks? i want an extension.

can we push it back a little? we need about four who are debates, we need more talk. another vp debate i think. no, i'm ready, john, aren't you? i'm so ready. i couldn't of went to bed last night and -- i'm debated out. >> do you know what i'm ready to be done with? i'm ready to be done with the on until midnight, on at 6:00 a.m. shift. >> i bet you are. >> it will be great when that's done. >> and i'm sick of tweeting. people are arguing on twitter. and i'm watching these conversations. it reminds me of the e-mail -- >> i love watching that. at least it gets people involved and you know they're paying attention and are -- >> i'm just worried it's a small subset of the world. >> guys, let me go over a couple high points and then we can get back to our coffee conversation. first of all, you had the candidates with completely different objectives last night. we talked before the debate to

mitt romney advisers, they said that his goal was to look like a president. to look like a commander in chief. he narrowed the gap with obama. he did that last night. he was not on offense against the president. it was mostly as if he were the incumbent trying to make v. a make no mistakes performance. president obama on the other hand liked the aggression that he showed and results in the second debate, so he was very much on offense, scored more debating points against mitt romney, repeatedly attacked him for being all over the map and tried to highlight contra did contradictions between rhetoric. it was a foreign policy debate, which is not as relatable to the average person. both tried to bring it down to where people could understand it when the subject of china and trade war came up, mitt romney said china exports thfr s this e export that much, they're the ones that don't want a trade war. president obama was trying to

cast mitt romney's thinking as way out of date. take a look. >> that will not cut our military budget by a trillion dollars. >> i think governor romney maybe hasn't spent enough time looking at how our military works. you mentioned the navy for example. and that we have fewer ships than we did in 1916. women, governor, we also have fewer horses and bayonets because the nature of our military's changed. we have these things called aircraft carriers where planes land on them. we have ships that go understand water. nuclear submarines. and so the question is not a game battleship. >> so the question when you get to the end of it, and some of the snap polls are showing that obama won is whether it makes any difference for him. the romney campaign and republican view was passing the commander in chief test was the last thing romney needed to do before turning back to the economy for the rest of the campaign, which both tried to do last mi last night.

the president's supporters argued they needed to stay on offense, raise doubts about romney among the undecided voters and also fire up their base and they're hoping they did that. >> didn't move the needle on intrade. 60 point 5. weird these polls, too. nothing's moved. they haven't since the first debate. well, moving, but they haven't reversed any of those gains after the first debate yet. we'll see. these polls are not conclusive, which is why we need to move the election at a time back so we can collect more thinking, talk more. >> you know what we could do, we could put it on new year's eve and we could vote on the election and fiscal cliff at the same time. >> good idea. john, is there more talk about what would happen if there is a split between who wins the popular vote and who wins the

electoral vote? >> goes to the electorals. >> but is there more talk of that likelihood at this point? >> well, yes. there's more talk of it. the closer you get to a 50/50 race, the more that becomes possible. obviously in our history, that is an extremely rare event. that's what made 2000 stand out. if you looked at the results today, you would say that there is the greater possibility if that happens would be that promi barack obama would win either electoral college and lose the popular vote. i think in the end that's not going happen because the votes around the country tend to be evenly distributed enough that if you have won enough states to win the electoral college, you've probably gotten more votes. it could happen the otherlikely. >> so you wrote the piece what

seemed line of scrimmage liked that the debates rarely matter. would you rewrite that now. >> what i said was that there are rare occasions when debates matter when you create a momentum wave like in 2000. bush against gore. and it does make a difference. i think we're about to discover whether this is one of those times where mitt romney's performance in the first debate confirmed by solid performances in the last two add up to -- and ryan's credible performance again biden add up to something that change the dynamic. i can tell you the view of the obama campaign is that the debate mattered less than we're saying for this reason, the first debate, that they came out of the conventions with a slight advantage over romney. romney cratered when the 47% video came out, he uncratered after the first debate. their view was that was going it

happen anyway and that we got back to where we were after the conventions with a slight obama advantage. but we'll see. i think from the superficial evidence, it looks like met romney got a significant boost from the first debate. whether that's an evening out that would have happened anyway, we can't know. >> we'll all know. thank the lord we'll know in a couple weeks. i'm ready. we are ready. and, boy, it is close for an incumbent. i can't imagine that there is not some nervousness i guess on both sides obviously. >> there is nervousnesses. i must say, i was struck in the -- at the debate site yesterday, respects. i must say, i was struck in the -- at the debate site yesterday, respect. i must say, i was struck in the -- at the debate site yesterday, respect by how both sides were saying they don't know what's going to happen. >> they better hope gallup is talk to the wrong people. and then you look at your electoral map on real clear

doesn't show obama with an advantage anymore either. even in the electoral map. even though -- >> no, no, if they take away swing states, it shows obama with 277. but it really comes down, joe, to how you define at this moment who is a likely voter and who has a better model for who is going to show up on election date. you know, we've got a likely voters screen on our nbc/"wall street journal" poll that the net result of which is we go from 49-44, a five point obama lead among all registered voters, to a tie at 47. the other polling organizations have different screens that get them to a different place. who has a better sense of it. do you know how we identify likely voters from registered voters? >> how? >> three questions that you have as a test. one, how interested are you on the election on a one to ten point scale. if you're a nine or ten, that's

a plus. did you vote in 2010. did you vote in 2008. those three things. if you say yes to two out of throws three, if you're a nine or ten and you voted in either of 10 or 08 or you voted in both those elections and you're a six, you're a likely voter. that's the test. >> does that undercount the youth vote, though, people who weren't able to vote four years ago? >> that is the one qualifier. which is if you were too young to vote, you can get in -- you can have it counted as a positive if you're a 7 or 8 on the 10 point scale. so by saying that level of interest, you get counted as a likely voter even if you weren't old enough to vote. >> i think should you ask if you -- >> you can tell any test like that it's a fallible test. >> i think you should ask if they know where the polling place is. to me that would be the ultimate signal they actually know -- if you actually knew where you were going, i think you're a likely

voter. >> andrew, that is the first thing that campaigns ask people when they do their telephone calls to identify potential supporters. they go right to do you know where you're going to vote. >> jop, one more question. early voting has been a bigger and bigger deal over the last two and four years. how many people do we expect will have voted before election day even gets here? >> about a third. and in some states, like iowa, a third have already voted. in iowa for example in our poll last week, which showed a much larger margin for obama than other polls have shown and we'll see whether that is borne out based in part of what the likely voter screen looks like, but 35% of the sample said that they had already voted. another 11% set they were going vote early. so what you ended up with was

just a little over half of the people voting on election day. romney had a big lead among those, but a disadvantage among those who had already voted. this is a slow rolling revolution in how we conduct elections. the obama team believes they have the advantage, but the republicans have been working aggressively to catch up. the advantage goes to that side. >> got to do it early. that was the comment yesterday -- john know, right? he said vote early in case your toilet backs up on election day. right, john? >> i did not hear that. but maybe that's wise advice. i don't know. >> something could happen. that was the point. >> anything could happen. >> anything could happen anytime. i know. that's why you have to stay watching. >> john, thank you. when we come back, yahoo!'s new ceo says the company is late to the game on mobile.

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yahoo! shares getting a boost. joining us now to talk about it and get analysis, anthony,

between mornigood morning. how long does the honeymoon last for thmarissa mayer? >> i think she did a great job on the call. sheout lined a clear vision for yahoo! and the key you have a new leader that is somebody that is a product person and i think the key is a lot of investors and analysts look at the core use hugh business, but really that's a small my newt part of the value here. so you're talking about nine bucks a share in ali baba and six bucks a share in cash. so that leaves between a buck and a buck 50 for core yahoo!. so you're getting such a free option on that business. i don't think it's a high hurdle. >> a lot of people are talking about different acquisition opportunities for her. is there stuff they can build

organically somehow do you you look at this? >> i would say three or four things. really she talked about mobile and mobile will be a challenge, but they do have brands that work. i think there's cost cuts to be had, the new cfo alluded to that. i don't think they'll go nuts on m&a. i think it will be small tuck in acquisitions. she it actuactually outlined a gave people a limit on those acquisitions. as far as deployment of cash and capital, a lot of that will go in to the buy back rights. so they have more than $3 billion that will come back -- >> why does this strategy sound different to you from what we've heard before? this is clearly a products strategy, but there have been other ceos that have had similar strategies. >> and she failed to execute. but she's a well regarded product person and respected in the industry. yahoo! has it share of

challenges in terms of users and engagement. no denying that. my only point standing up here is that the market is giving you a free option, really valuing core use yahoo! at one times cash flow. this is generating a lot of cash on a go forward basis. in terms of leadership, i think you have a leader in there hopefully some stability. let's be honest. if you look at carol bartz, scott thompson, they just haven't executed. so now you have a new leader that's kind of provided her vision. >> so give me the honeymoon time period. we're at 1620 on the stock. a year from how, if the stock hasn't moved or if the stock moves even slightly down, slightly up, how long does she really have to make this work? >> i think the question is that i think there's a h-- if the market put as one times

multiple, the question is how much do you value ali baba or yahoo! japan. i think the market will give her a few quarters. maybe a year. and i think that gives her some time to kind of improve things at core yahoo!. >> anthony, thank you very much. coming up, we'll go global. we're looking for opportunities at home and abroad. a few options from a top money manager when we return. two years ago, the people of bp made a commitment to the gulf. bp has paid over twenty-three billion dollars to help those affected and to cover cleanup costs. today, the beaches and gulf are open, and many areas are reporting their best tourism seasons in years. and bp's also committed to america. we support nearly 250,000 jobs and invest more here than anywhere else.

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1.37 from tipping operations which is well above the expectation which was for 1.18 a share. the company is also saying that it sees 2012 earning of 525 to 535. the 15 billion in third quarter sales was versus an expectation of 15.1. the company is forecasting 48.536 billion is what wall street is expecting for united technologies. which after all was said and done, it's unclear. it has a 7575 bid. high and low here, 87 on the

high side, 70 on the low side. >> a lot of this comes from less dilution. >> i see that. expect just 10% of dilution from the goodrich acquisition. but i haven't looked, if they say continuing operations, we would hope that they've done the math for us and that that is versus the 1.18. p. >> one other thing they do point out is again for some of the big industrial companies, we try and get a sense of what's been happening just for the economy overall, one of the comments that the chair hand and ceo makes is due to the lack of recovery in the commercial air space after market and continued uncertainty in the global economy, they're thousand looking for 2012 sales of about $58 billion. still a lot of uncertainty.

58 billion in sales. 2012 estimate is 58.5 billion. so roughly this line, but the street is about half a billion higher than what they are right now talking about. >> joining us from chicago, kevin ferry. tell me your point, everything is down in october is this. >> yeah, it seems like the same story. numbers look okay, but there is concern about revenue. silver, gold, yen is down. ten year bond is down. s&p, nasdaq futures. so your question is where did it all go. >> prior to this, you hads always seen a movement out of one asset class into another. the easiest being the inter-day play between equity and bond

market. but since october 5th, this was a significant wipe down in just about everything that we track. and so this morning it looked like maybe the yen would try and reverse that course and now it's stabilizing again. i think it's been an odd october. unless everybody is just going on to the sidelines and holding on to cash until after the election, which could be. but it's very odd that you've seen just about everything that people have been trying to buy in october go down. >> true. we spent a lot of time with john harwo harwood, so we'll see you soon, though. but that was a good point. i don't know where it went. i haven't liquidated anything. nothing. >> no guesseses as es as to wh went? >> it's a head scratcher. >> money heaven.

>> even i bought some bonds and it's been a terrible trip. so it's been difficult. it's better that the the market is down this morning as opposed to up yesterday. so if we're going to see somebody come back, we'd like it to come from down. >> but the expectation is maybe cash on the sidelines? >> i don't know. everybody can't lose, right? it's very shocking. one of the main theme as this you've heard throughout september and october was buy. you were supposed to be buying something. just incredible. >> all right. kevin, we'll talk to you again soon. we go to the rest of the world right now. head of he emerging markets at morgan stanley, and written a new book breakout nations in pursuit of the next economic miracles. you are of the opinion that the brics are broken. do you want to explain why you think they're broken and why we need to look beyond that for new

growth? >> yeah, i think that -- slowing down quite sharply. that's the beg story of this your. so you have china going from 10% down to 6%, 7% at best. india done to 6%, as well. and russia growing at 2%, 3%. and south africa down to about 2.5%. so i think this is a disappointment in what were the stars of the emerging markets space over the past decade. and it's time to look beyond these stars in search of the new breakout nations. countries likely to beat expectations and grow faster than what people expect. but i think this is a new era that we're entering and it has major implications including for commodity prices.

the super cycle seems to be draw to go a close. this is a major defining shift and possibly marks the first year in that shift. >> that's an incredible interesting thesis. yesterday we had marc faber on the program and he took a look at what's been happening with the chinese stock market. he said he would be buying chinese stocks but not because of some broader economic recovery that he sees in china, who are because he thinks it's a gr great valuation call. is there a chance investors could be lured back? >> it could be with the chinese stock market and growth of the economy are constant cousins. ever since the embassy conceived back in 1995, the total return of the index is zero.

so there is not much linkage between growth and the underlying stock market. i'm not sure that's about to change all of a sudden. people are trying to bottom pick the chinese sock market, but i just don't know whether that connection can be made that easily and i'm still a bit skeptical of that. >> very similar argument to what jim chanos has made to us in the past, too. the feds and central banks and other nations that are pumping out money, is that something that could keep the commodities boom alive? >> i think that's already happening. there's a big gap between the well treated commodities and all the other which are on their back. so i think that has already happened. but my fear is that there is only that much liquidity that could sustain these asset classes. because gold of course is a different animal. it's a store of value. but if you look at oil and

copper, these commodities i think are really skating on thin ice here because demand is weakening substantially for these commodities. take the case of oil. the chinese demand was about 8% a year. it's running at 2.5% a year and the chinese accounted for more than half of the incremental demand over the past decade. so i think there's only so much liquidity can do and it's already playing a role, but i doubt it can sustain itself for too long if the underlying demand and fundamentals are looking weak. >> i'm sorry we're out of time. i'd love to have you back to explain more. but you say the places you like, philippines, thailand, turkish, poland -- if you had to pick one star? >> the biggest star looks like the philippines because it's comeback star. it's a big laggard, but shows of coming back from the dead. so i'd say that looks pretty good among the six or seven countries. but in-that all of them are major breakout nations of the

coming decade. >> thank you very much for your time and we'll have you back. if you have comments or questions about anything you see here, squawk@cnbc.com. coming up, a top exec from raymond james, we'll talk financials, the fed and the looming fiscal cliff. but first as we head to a break, check out the greenback. [ female announcer ] i found the best cafe in the world.

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i just said it yodiot, but it dt go out there. financial leaders are meeting this morning, sifma. ted helk is the ceo of the global private group at raymond james and also the chairman of sifma. i'm looking at some of your comments. and just so true at this point. and it's like all m-- all occasion doth inform against us. everything has gone against an in- investor thinking. with facebook and just one thing after another, public trust and confidence at this meeting got to be a big subject i would think. >> there's no question about it as you point out, the hits just

keep on coming. there's just endless parade of all sorts of headlines that serve to cause people to really not have confidence in the future. so we've got to get on top of that and we've got to get the public trust and confidence back on track for the economy and for the markets and for the entire system to get back to anything people are proud to be a part of. >> i don't know who you blame for facebook. andrew wrote a great column on how we should look at that. but then you got washington hasn't been very helpful either. right? >> we have a lot of work to do. there is no end to the blame that we can point fingers with. but frankly, that's why we have these meetings. that's why we get together and talk about what we as an industry can do working with the folks in washington, working with the other regulators around the world actually to try get a framework of regulation that

will put guardrails around this thing. but the fact is it comes back to the individual firms and in fact the individual people who have to take personal responsibility for the kind of good decision making, risk management, transparency and the other issues that will be essential for the public to have faith in for them to have the confidence to get back in and be participants in the market and franly f ll ll ll lly frankly f owners to have the confidence to hire new employees. >> i can see that because it's not a firm that we really ever talk about in the context of what happened a couple of years ago. you can legislate with dodd-frank, but if common sense had been used, a lot of this stuff would not have used. >> i think you're so right. there are a lot of good firms like raymond james who have stuck to the principles that lead to good results.

putting the client first has to be the paramount driver. people trust with you your money. you're a fiduciary regardless of what the law says. you have to take that seriously. and risk management is what it's all about. you can't get your clients to out there and you can't get your firm too out there. the overuse of leverage was common among all the firms that got in trouble, so there are a lot of well managed firms who didn't do that. and people have to understand that it's possible to be successful in this and we've got to get them back to the point where they can believe that. >> all right. thank you. good look. you got your work cut out for you. we want you to succeed, as well. fair and transparent markets help everyone and then the markets can go up easier. it's been 11 years and that's part of the problematic. you could put stocks on sale and just put them at a 20% discount to where they're trading and you eat the difference to get a little bit of interest at raymond james. have you thought about that some just an idea. never mind. that might not work.

anyway, chet, thank you. coming up at 8:10, commodities futures trading commission going to be our special guest today. >> squawk just getting started. we have newsmakers. up next, he's walk to the set right now, steeple financial chairman and ceo. >> you did it. that was good. between listening to the numbers... ...and listening to your instinct. duff & phelps finds the sweet spot that powers sound decisions. duff & phelps financial advisory and investment banking services. if we want to improve our schools... ... what should we invest in? maybe new buildings? what about updated equipment? they can help, but recent research shows... ... nothing transforms schools like investing in advanced teacher education.

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welcome back to "squawk box" on this tuesday morning. ron khrushchevsky joins us on set, we've been talking for the past couple weeks if not more about the fiscal cliff and what it means. you have a more interesting perspective given the business you're in about what will happen next. >> the fiscal cliff what i think is that an obama, if he wins the election, i think the odds of the fiscal cliff becoming reality sky rocket and the reason for that is simply there will be a mandate and there's no way the house republicans will go for his policies. it will be a standoff that will make the two summers ago the debt crisis look like child's play. >> last night i don't know if you saw in the debate he said something to the effect that he

was not going to push for the sequester. >> president obama said first of all it was the republican's idea and second of all it's not going to happy he was never asked to clarify. >> i loved the comment except there was absolutely nothing as to how it's not going to happen. it's going to happen now because it's law and the way it's not going to happen is someone is going to stand up and propose something. >> explain this. we talk about the fiscal cliff all the time and it sounds like this big bad thing. i'm not sure what happens, meaning what is going to happen to businesses in your mind? >> we're in a sluggish recovery at best, slow, slow, slow. so next year the fiscal cliff if you look at the cbo, 3% to 5% of gdp in an economy that's going to grow 2. that means you're putting this country in a deep recession by the mere fact that you'll cut government spending. where i went to school government spending is part of gdp, you'll cut government spending and increase taxes at

absolutely the worst possible time. it would be a disaster and the business community is very concerned about this. and it shouldn't even be on the table. >> fiscal cliff is one problem, ron, the second though is even if we get past that, kick the can down the road there's the fiscal abyss or grand canyon. you are going to have to do something to cut spending and raise revenue down the road to te deal with that. two years ago was worse, four years ago was worse. >> there's no question but you don't create an environment where it's going to happen in two months. it hurts confidence, it hurts in business investment. you have to start with bowles-simpson, that was a bipartisan solution and get this fixed. not everyone is going to like it. revenues have to be raised. >> do you think bowles-simpson would work, if there was an up or down vote in the country, sent out a pamphlet said everyone read it, do you think

people would vote in favor of it? the business community says yes, i'm skeptical that the broader world would, because you'd have to give up so much on both sides. >> exactly, but unless both sides give up so much then the problem will never be solved. so you know, come on, there needs to be a little bit of leadership. people need to stand up and say we need a solution that's going to cause pain for everyone and get this thing fixed. >> joe was talking about about the bonds. >> yeah, i didn't see this, the parent company of ge had not issued debt for five years, so 5 billion of debt was coming due and this week they sold $7 billion worth of debt and actually it's cited the fiscal cliff they're not going to be in a position to refinance or sell debt at the beginning of the year just in case and a lot of other companies will follow ge.

>> i look at that concept is that the federal government will get downgraded, so interest rates are going to go up, credit spreads will widen and if you're running a business you'll anticipate that and try to get ahead of it. ge is hedging this issue. i have to tell you something, if this fiscal cliff becomes reality all 535 people in washington should be kicked out. it is absolutely reckless to have this country's economy held hostage to an inability to get anything done. >> ron, who do you think the market is expecting is going to win right now? >> the market thinks obama is going to win. that's clear, but -- >> with the fiscal cliff ahead of us and yet look where the market's gone. >> correct. the market i think is underestimating the risk of the fiscal cliff if obama gets elected and that's because tax policy starts in the ways and means committee and the house of

representatives. that's controlled by the republicans and i don't think it's even compromising on this issue, but this election's going to be very close. >> we're going to leave it there. ron thank you for being here. >> thank you. coming this up worn's top stories, quarterly results from 3m and ups plus reaction to last night's debate. stay tuned. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 after that, it's on to germany. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 then tonight, i'm trading 9500 miles away in japan. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 with the new global account from schwab, tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 i hunt down opportunities around the world tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 as if i'm right there. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and i'm in total control because i can trade tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 directly online in 12 markets in their local currencies. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 i use their global research to get an edge. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 their equity ratings show me how schwab tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 rates specific foreign stocks tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 based on things like fundamentals, momentum and risk. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and i also have access to independent

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the run-up to a barrage of corporate earnings. quarterly reports from us and 3m coming up this hour. get the numbers and instant analysis only here. the face-off in florida. >> i see our influence receding in part because of the failure of the president to deal with

our economic challenges. >> what the american people understand is that i look at what we need to get done to keep the american people safe and move our interests forward. >> it's your money, your vote as the final presidential debate wraps up, democratic strat geez bob shrum is our guest and rob portman, what happens from now until election day. we're dialing in donald trump, what the real estate titan is seeing in business and politics. the second hour of "squawk box" begins right now. ♪ >> welcome back to "squawk box" on cnbc. i'm andrew ross sorkin along with joe kernen and becky quick. in studio with us, bob shrum, democratic strategist, his thoughts on last night's final debate and senator rob portman will be joining us in 15 minutes. it's tuesday, time for donald

trump, the real estate king is calling into the show, the donald calling into the show at the bottom of the hour. we're also on tech watch this morning as we await apple's announcement of the ipad mini. we'll have a preview of today's media event later and the top of the next hour senator john kerry will be our special guest and then this is even more special, singer and musician john popper of blues traveler in the house, we're going to talk music, politics and much, much more so we have a busy show ahead. becky? >> andrew, thank you. still trying to figure out why we were playing blondie at the top. i'll think about that for a minute. there are serious red arrows, you'll see the dow futures are down triple digits down by 105 points, s&p futures off by 15 points, nasdaq futures down by 1% as well and this is all coming as we get some more bad earnings that are in. we are going to have highlights of last night's presidential debate in a moment. before we do that let's get through the business headlines.

look at dupont, this is the first of the big dow components to report today, dupont shares are under pressure after a shortfall on the top and the bottom lines. dupont came in with earnings of 44 cents a share when you exclude certain items, two cents below what the street was expecting. revenue of $7.4 billion was well short of the $8.2 billion the street was looking for. dupont is pointing to some shortfalls in its paint and solar panel segments, also mentioned weakness in asia as well. yahoo! registering a solid beat earnings 35 cents for the third quarter, the first earnings report since marisa meyer became the chief executive officer. >> this is job, the core components of yahoo! business, search, mail, ads, mobile, news and the home page are also the core products that i built my career upon. so my answer is simple, i came to yahoo! to grow and to help

redefine one of the internet's most beloved companies. >> cnbc and yahoo! we have a business alliance to share and co-produce editorial content. fed policymaker also begin a two-day meeting today. unlike last time around that was when we were looking for the new round of quantitative easing. this meet something expected to be far less eventful. joe? >> thank you, becky. wow. just reading this thing about rory mcilroy, just coming out. guess how much nike is reportedly set to pay him for a ten-year deal? >> uhm, a lot i would guess? >> 70 million. >> no. >> more. >> 100? >> more. >> all of the money they were using on lance armstrong they can give him. >> so clean cut and good and 23 years ago and starts with a q. >> quadrillion? >> almost, a quarter.

>> 250 million. >> 250? >> 250. unless you're talking about pounds. it's a conversion but if you get it, i have $20, i'll get it if you get it exactly right how many pounds? >> 147 billion -- million. >> no, 191 in over ten years and he will join tiger woods -- >> you write the pounds a lot. >> yeah, but that is really interesting. oh, this is you. i talked so long, i had to read but now it's gone. >> this is a story near and dear to our hearts, with he talk about blackberries all the time. the u.s. government hanging up on blackberry. this is official now. >> oh, no. >> this is crazy. the immigration and customs enforcement agency ending its contract with blackberry maker r.i.m. in favor of apple's iphone. the agency saying it intends to buy more iphones for its 17,600

employees so think about that, 17,600 employees just losing, going straight to the iphone. the agency relied on r.i.m. for eight years but the company "can no longer meet the mobile technology needs of the agency." the iphone will be used by a variety of agency personnel including homeland security investigators and blackberry's one claim to fame besides the keyboard has been security and the government needs to use it -- >> wait -- >> that was always the argument. >> the iphone was not as secure. >> brick breaker is the other. i decided i'm sticking. >> i'm sticking with it, too, but i'm in big trouble, i need to learn how to use the stupid touch screens because eventually the keyboard will be gone. for the iphone there's apparently one you can plug in, a keyboard but that's so clunky. >> yes. no, i made this, plus there's a big thing i'm supposed to fill out to get an iphone. >> that's the real reason, you

don't want to fill out the documentation. >> it's the keyboard. >> i spent so much time e-mailing and typing notes and typing columns and things on it, i can't do it. >> i'd have to stop drinking, bob. the slightest bit of a shake in your hands you can't do the iphone. >> i have a friend in boston, chuck campion who held on to his blackberry religiously. what he finally did a few weeks ago, retired it, got an iphone, went on his facebook page, put a picture of the blackberry, r.i.p. >> have you tried to send an e-mail? >> i can't type an e-mail so i'm as bad a typist on the blackberry as on the iphone. >> i can do it one-handed on a blackberry. >> we are serious ludits. >> how about if you still write everything down? >> you do type by the way.

>> you have' seen me do that. i don't really unless it's really important, something with the kids or something. let's get a check on the overseas market. ross westgate joins us from london and there are some serious red arrows over here, i'm guessing you're seeing the same there. >> yes, we're down the session low, becky, good morning to you. red as you can see, advancers outpaced by decliners more than 9 :1. we are low at the session lows, 1.2 for the ftse, xetra dax 1.4%. the ibex in spain in a second. one stock has been outperforming, arm holdings up 5.21, a chip designer that go into apple products, microprocessors for smartphones and tablets. the group has a record order

backlog for the fourth quarter so a profit of 22% in the third quarter, ahead of estimates as well. so once again, mobile's where it's at, makes design chips for mobile, they are outperforming the general market. let's show you where we are with debt yields. they have nudging higher in spain and italy. italy 4.78%. 5.55, well below 6% for spain. there was good news today, another auction short term debt the six-month t bills, yields lower than september 25th, higher on the three-month but maximum target at 3.5 billion was raised but looks like a big down at the moment for stocks. back to you guys. >> okay, ross, thank you. see you later. i tweeted to you, ross. i don't know, your call anchor got on, i'm not sure what's happening but i was tweeting you. did you get my tweet to you? >> i did and i responded to your tweet and i think katie just monitors everything and she's a part of my tweet air life.

>> she's got her finger -- you guys are like married, she's involved with, because she's your co-anchor, really in. >> but you know this relationship. it's an on-air screen wifey relationship. >> brother thing but in a northern state. >> yeah. the president candidate sparring over -- i can get bob. sparring over foreign policy issues in last night's final presidential debate, both candidates saying china needs to play by the rules. >> i want a great relationship with china. china can be our partner but that doesn't mean they can roll all over us and steal our jobs on an unfair basis. >> governor romney is right. you are familiar with jobs being shipped overseas because you invested in companies that were shifting jobs overseas. you're right, that's how our free market works but i've made a different bet on american

workers. >> and the two also sparred over russia. >> i'm glad that you recognize that al qaeda is a threat because a few months ago when you were asked what's the biggest geopolitical threat facing america, you said russia, not al qaeda, you said russia, in the 1980s, now calling to ask for their policy back because the cold war has been over for 20 years. >> russia i indicated is a geopolitical foe -- >> not number one -- >> excuse me, i said in the same paragraph "and iran is the greatest national security threat we face." russia does continue to battle us in the u.n. time and time again. >> a quick reaction from guest host the famous bob shrum and bob, since we don't have much time, whatever you say i'm not going to disagree with at all. >> i was startled romney pleaded nolo contendere, agreed with the

president on syria and iran, got into a disagreement on iraq, which i think was a big mistake on his part and didn't turn the debate to economic issues. jfk did it with national security debate right at the beginning, didn't really turn the critique to economic issues until near the end and got pounded on the auto bailout. >> bob, one of the president's strengths has always been his likability and some people pointed out because of the performance in the first debate he had to come out hard on the last couple, and i've seen comments like condescender-in-chief, someone wrote their kids are afraid of the hate stare. >> i think those people were never for obama in the first place, because if you look at the favorability and likability numbers in the polls. >> he had to ramp it up. >> he ramped it up. >> even john harwood who is not on either side said the style hurt the substance. >> i don't think the style hurt at all and in fact the other thing that startled me was that

romney was sweating and he looked sort of non-plussed at several points. i'm not saying he was nixon. he looked like he was under pressure. people want out of these foreign policy debates. foreign policy is not the cutting edge issue. sense that guy they see get off the plane with the fellow or woman walking behind him holding the brief case that contains the nuclear codes, they want the sense the person knows what they're doing, is really rooted and is consistent. i mean did you hear the spin last night, it was clear the romney people thought they lost because the spin became well we just wanted to show that we were for peace, the romney was for peace. he doesn't have a reagan problem. people didn't think that going into this that mitt romney was going to start a war. he has a consistency conviction problem. >> the president said a few times do you want to star a war. >> ronald reagan went into the '80s debate saying people think he was going to start to war. romney got bruised so badly in

the libya debate they decided to back off. >> is this a loss or a tie or nothing? we were talking to harwood this idea maybe this particular debate doesn't change the game. >> i didn't think the first debate actually changed the game. i think it narrowed the -- >> oh, hold on, hold on. even i will disagree with that. the first debate -- look at the polls. >> no, but structurally in the battleground states the president still has an advantage. i don't think this debate changed the game but i think it left people with the sense this guy might be a little out of his depth on foreign policy. >> bob, do you think it's untoward or at least not good that the democrats and the media were more jaut raged by romney's initial statements about libya, shown more outrage than about not having security there, and not getting the true story for two weeks? it seems a little weird that is the bigger issue.

>> nobody was concealing the true story as "the new york times" laid it out yesterday, that story evolved over time from the cia and the administration shared it every step of the way. think romney made a big mistake. if you don't believe me why didn't he come back on libya. they decided to avoid it, decided it was a big problem, they decided they'd politically exploit it. >> you think that was a strategy before the debate. >> let's ask portman. >> i was going to ask portman why you wouldn't hammer that point home. if you do, media will go along with the democrats but i think that's a distasteful thing to point out one comment that romney made the same day, none of the outrage, even throw in fast and furious, the more outrage about one perceived gaffe, but you know, you got -- >> fast and furious, i think when people, when they start talking about this i think voters out there say what are they talking about? >> no, i think a lot of voters

understand. >> andrew, are you ready? >> okay, here we go, still to come, earnings news from 3m and us and we'll get the numbers and market reaction plus a preview of today's apple event and what to expect when the company reports earnings tomorrow. coming up next we'll ask senator rob portman about last night's debate. "squawk" is back after this. americans believe they should be in charge of their own future. how they'll live tomorrow. for more than 116 years, ameriprise financial has worked for their clients' futures. helping millions of americans retire on their terms. when they want. where they want. doing what they want. ameriprise. the strength of a leader in retirement planning. the heart of 10,000 advisors working with you one-to-one. together for your future. ♪

joining with reaction to the debate last night, senator rob portman and i need to warn our guest host is bob shrum, rob. he's former presidential campaign manager and democratic strategist and rob, i don't know whether, senator, whether your ears were burning but i asked a question if the democrats and the media have given more attention to romney's first comments about libya than not ramping up security on the anniversary of september 11th, and then hearing this bizarre story for two or three weeks about a video and about no one should be making a video like that and you got to expect this to happen, why didn't romney go

after that? was that part of the strategy? >> no, i don't think there was a direct question on it. i think he has gone after it clearly in the past saying one, the security wasn't there that should have been there and that's a failing of the administration and second, he's talked a lot about the confusion after the fact and said look, it's very clear it was a terrorist act. he said last night it was a terrorist act. why didn't the president stick to that story? he's been clear on it in the past. what he did do is used benghazi as an example of the broader problem in the middle east, talked about the spreading of islamic extremism and he supported the president going after bin laden, supported the president on using drones but we need a broader strategy and that's where he laid out the vision to deal with the underlying problem of the spread that clearly has put the middle east into chaos. >> are you going to be able to deliver ohio? can you give us a feel on the ground what it's like there? you can probably deliver cincinnati, although i heard cincinnati, i asked kasich athen

kasich is ready to argue with everybody. i was asking him from your side but he's ready to just start arguing because he was on fox for a while or something, but i asked him, cincinnati i've heard, cincinnati used to be reliably red and i've heard now cincinnati has gotten a little bit purple. i figure you can deliver your area, cincinnati but you can't counteract cleveland. is romney still down in ohio, which used to be reliable for republicans? >> first of all i appreciate your confidence in me. i'll do all i can to earn that. >> you no he that. >> and make you right, joe. being a cincinnati guy that media mark of cincinnati is going to be republican. hamilton county, which is where cincinnati is, did go with president obama four years ago. i don't think it will happen because the enthusiasm and energy is on our side this year. it's different than 2008. we're doing fine in ohio, it's a dead heat. couple weeks ago we were down five points so it's moving in the right direction at this

point in the campaign with a couple weeks left you want to have the trend in your direction and that's where it is. we've done stuff on the ground in ohio we've never done before, knocked on 25 times more doors doing the door-to-door campaigning than all of 2008 already, made three times more phone calls than 2008 all with volunteers so our rallies are huge, we got the ultimate compliment reporters saying these were obama-like crowds which frankly we haven't been able to get in 2008 in particular. there's a lot of energy on our sides. it will be close. >> senator, i noticed last night both candidates tried to turn back to the economy as often as possible, this was supposed to be the foreign policy debate but the economy is front and center for americans right now. what needs to happen with the economy and why do you think this is your strong point when the other side thinks it's got a lot of big points including bringing up what happened with the auto companies in ohio, a

point president obama was able to make? >> i think this was appropriate that they talked about the economy last night because as the moderator and everybody else made clear last night it's important in terms of our international relations to have a strong economy, we talked about the fact last night that the debt is very important to how we're perceived around the world and america's influence is dependent on our strength at home. i think it's an appropriate move to the economy and frankly it's great for governor romney, he's able to talk about the fact that things have not worked in the last four years as promised by the president and he has a plan, an agenda to get the economy back on track. having played the role of barack obama and i don't know how bob shrum feels about this but a lot of democrats agree with me it's surprising the president has not laid out on agenda for a plan for the future. >> rob, are you still -- >> i know he is. >> -- sharp from doing the mock debates with romney? because i'm going to release bob shrum on you. >> shrum can play the role of romney i'll play the role of

obama. >> i don't need to be unleashed. first thing i should say is i think romney should have picked you for vice president although i'm not sure my endorsement would have helped in that process. secondly, i want to go back to the libya question because the first question that was asked by bob schieffer on benghazi, what happened there, gave romney the opening to repeat his critique. surely in this debate prep you discussed what tone he was going to take on libya and all of the things you said a few minutes ago about delaying the explanation, about the back of security, romney didn't say. did he decide to walk away from that issue because it's a loser? >> i don't think it's a loser, bob, political pli. i think the polling is probably all over the place on that. i think he wanted to use it as an example to talk about the broader problems in the middle east and i think he was effective at that and again just as i mentioned on the economy having a strategy and a vision is important he did lay out a strategy to deal with the

underlying cause of the spread of islamic fundamentalism and extremism, and that to me, what was missing on the president's part is he didn't take the opportunity to talk about more than drone strikes and taking out bin laden. >> senator, i thought it was great. i thought it was great that he didn't do it. >> thanks, rob. >> thanks, rob. futures are down triple digits, we'll talk about that shortly and earnings from u.p.s. and 3m after this break. so anyway, i've been to a lot of places. you know, i've helped a lot of people save a lot of money. but today...( sfx: loud noise of large metal object hitting the ground) things have been a little strange. (sfx: sound of piano smashing) roadrunner: meep meep. meep meep?

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welcome back. the futures are down triple digits this morning. this all kicked off with earnings season which continues to disappoint this morning. dupont out with earnings that were less than the street had been expecting both on the top and bottom line and that stock is down more than 5% this morning. duff & phelps finds the sweet spot that powers sound decisions. duff & phelps financial advisory and investment banking services. he loves risk. but whether he's climbing everest,

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welcome back to "squawk box" this morning. let's recap some of the earnings that have crossed the tape. worth noting that futures are off triple digits. dow component dupont earnings had 4 cents per share for the third quarter, two cents shy of estimates, revenue coming up on weakness on dupont's paint and solar panel part segments. it will cut 1,500 jobs in an effort to remain more competitive and radio shack reporting a bigger than expected loss, 33 cents per share on weaker margins on its smartphone

business. 3m is out. >> it's below on revenue $1.65 was in line but the 7.5 billion in revenue is just slightly below the $7.63, but the guidance now for the fiscal year earnings per share is $6.27 to $6.35, below $6.40 where the street is. kind of not great. >> they had strong operating margins, all six businesses posted 20% operating margins so they say they continue to execute well. i bet it was getting hurt with dupont numbers, too. >> the number is slightly below and the guidance, they cut the guide absence fance for the yeal come out of the fourth quarter. at $1.52, only one quarter left and they said $6.27 to $6.35. it's a nickel below the street so that would be $1.47 would be the best case versus a $1.52

estimate and if it got down to the $6.27 number that would be -- >> it is lower than their previous guidance, not only below what the street was expecting. it says reflecting current economic realities with i is what we've heard again and again over the last couple of weeks with earnings, a difficult environment, difficult economic realities. you hear this from just about every company. it's probably not a surprise to be hearing this, but maybe the street's getting some worse guidance than they'd been anticipating for looking at things as well. >> sales 7.5 billion down 0.4%, year over year. it's not just below expectations, it's below last year, organic loca currency sales grew 2.2%, acquisitions added 0.5% and currency impact reduced sales by 3.1% year over year. >> if you look at their different units, industrial and

transportation sales down 0.5% and consumer and office was up 1.6% in u.s. dollars, display and graphics was flat in terms of sales and safety security and protection service was down 2.9% in u.s. sales. electro and communications down 2.1%, so a lot of different units they have. >> that's hitting the dow futures and bring up due pobt, was trying to come back but dupont is now 46.57 to 47.22 versus a 49i.76 close. add 3m and dupont into the mix for the dow and you can see why the dow is indicated down triple digits. is utx able to buck the trend even though it was higher? no. 75, 75 to 80.

united technologies is not the same business. >> futures turned down with dupont at 6:00, at that point it could have been an okay trading session. >> this may be the worst revenue performance since 2009 but a lot of it is currency. >> that's not a surprise. analysts should have known that coming into it. shouldn't be as big of a surprise as you would think. >> shouldn't be as bad but people don't care. >> i think probably what's concerning is the outlook from the companies. they say they can't see that far down the road, they're concerned, it's a difficult outlook. >> you will still get 60% companies beat on the bottom line, but you know what? you can't screw around with the top line as easily. >> always. >> it's not like the bls where you can sort of -- i knew i'd get you. don't you like coming in here?

>> i never know what fantasy is coming out of your head. >> i'm joking. >> you weren't necessarily joking. lot of people you agree with. maybe your next guest will not be joking. >> media matters, is that the name of those clowns in. >> they do. donald trump is the chairman and president of the trump organization and he is standing by on the trump news line. good morning to you. >> good morning. >> so let me ask you this as the leader of a business company as well, we have been getting all this guidance from companies where people say they're not sure about the future, it's hard to see out, it's been surprising to watch this continue to come in as difficult economic environment is the comment we hear from a lot of them. what do you see? >> well the economy is not doing well, and i've been telling you that for quite a while, when they came out with those ridiculous numbers last week, 7.8% unemployment. the economy is not doing well, and you're starting to see it in the big companies and in fact based on everything you said this morning, i think i will go and run out and buy some 3m and

dupont stock. i love it when i see a big drop for good companies. >> we saw how well you've done with apple when you started buying it. >> i said to joe last week we didn't buy apple but one of my great brokers audrey dumm of oppenheimer informed me i had actually bought a quit of apple a long time ago so i'm happy about that. she's done a great job. she's done a great job. >> let's focus back on the debate last night. >> okay. >> and what you think happened. people were watching last night, foreign policy. some of the snap polls that i had seen put president obama as the winner of this debate. how much do you think that matters? >> well, i don't know that it mattered because i found it very hard to watch. i think a lot of people were turning off. i think bob would agree and bob's a real pro, and bob would agree the audience was not going to be nearly as large and i think toward the end the audience might have been very small. i will say i would have liked to have seen, i think what i would have like to see mitt be much,

much more aggressive. >> bob? >> i think that's honest. i think that's a completely truthful reaction. as i said earlier i was stunned that he went in there and gave up on a whole series of issues and when he turned it to the economy at the end he didn't do particularly well. that exchange on, why he wanted to get into an exchange on the auto bailout was beyond me but to give up on this libya thing after he invested so much in it i think was a big mistake. to let the president characterize his tax cut as a $5 trillion tax cut with no offsets, doesn't add up, no answer, that was a big mistake. so even when he got to the economy i don't think he was doing very well. donald trump is right about one other thing. there was a baseball game last night to determine who is going to go into the world series and there were a lot of people watching that. >> sunday nigmonday night footb. >> since it was 9-0, my guess is people may have come back to the debate for a few minutes but in the end what you take out of the debate is the president is commander in chief and you're not sure romney can be.

>> i think, bob, he wanted to show moderation, he wanted to show a certain soft side because he was pretty strong in the other debate and he was particularly strong in the first debate which is by far was his greatest performance, and i think he wanted to show a certain moderation and i know for a fact because i've already spoken to some of his people, they were very happy but i thought he had so much material in terms of foreign -- libya is a disaster, not only the coverup but why we went in there, and what we did and what we got out of it. what did we get out of it? we got nothing. you know who got a lot out of it, china, because they get their oil from libya, we get nothing. so as usual we got nothing. that's never discussed. what's discussed is the coverup and i thought it was great, great material for mitt romney and he chose to go a different way. i think the debate was even but i would have liked to have seen him go much more aggressive. >> totally different topic, you

grace the cover of magazines traditionally and we heard last week that "newsweek" is no longer going to be printing its magazine. do you have views on this? >> well i do. it's a sad case, in fact i jokingly said on my twitter that, i tweeted last week that now i'll have to take all my "newsweek" covers off my wall. it has been over for "newsweek" for a long time. it's sad when you look at it, like paper thin. it used to be a great magazine. it's not a great magazine anymore. it's also a trend. lot of other magazines are going to be clothsing up, too, "time" magazine, how thin it is. it was like a feather last week. you could throw it up in the air and it would blow away. >> what are you doing tomorrow, this tweet? >> i will probably be working hard on making doral the greatest resort anywhere in the world. >> this tweet, you got some big tweet that's going to blow everything wide open. >> well i do. i do. i'm not going to talk about it now but i do have something that's very big.

>> about president obama? >> it's about president obama, yes. >> can you go i have us a hint? >> no, but tomorrow you'll see. >> will it make any more sense than birtherism? >> i think it's going to make a lot of sense. i think birtherism makes a lot of sense to a lot of people to be honest with you. i think a lot of people agree with that particular stance and if you look at polls where you have 27, 28, 29% of the people, a lot of people agree with it and a lot of people like me very much because of that. all we want is the truth, bob. >> when are they going to have you campaign with romney? >> all we want is the truth. >> when are they going to have you campaign with romney? you didn't speak at the conveng, not in the ads, if you're so popular and birtherism is so good, when are you going to get on the campaign trail with romney. >> they want me to and asked me to and i will be doing that in. >> when? >> starting probably in about a week, a week before the end. >> we'll see. i'll make you a small, you have a lot more money than i do, i

make you a ten-buck bet that your he not doing a rally today. jfk made a comment a lot of smart businessmen turn out to be dumb s.o.b.s when it comes to politics. >> not smart enough to get into bootlegging. >> you know, guys like you, hey, bob, guys like you are what set this country so far behind. we're now a laughing stock throughout the world. >> no, donald you're a laughing stock. >> and our president has done a terrible job. you should wish him luck. >> we can talk about laughing stocks birther sichl a laughing stock. >> mitt romney will be much more aggressive, i will agree with you there's so much to be aggressive about. obama has done a very poor job. >> all right. excellent. you guys really, that's what you really think, i think shrks rum.

>> that is what i think. >> we'll be watching tomorrow donald. >> very good. >> what time? >> probably 12:00 or so. we'll let you know. >> okay. thank you, donald. >> okay. >> lunch at the four seasons for both of you. coming up we'll go global with the head of global research and next hour senator rand paul to discuss last night's debate and founding member of blues traveler, the master john popper will be our special guest, shares his political views, business savvy and talked about his latest projects, that interview coming up about an hour from now. stick around for that and we've got a lot going on in the markets today. bob... oh, hey alex. just picking up some, brochures, posters copies of my acceptance speech. great! it's always good to have a backup plan,

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welcome back to "squawk." futures are down and down big across the board. dow would open up about 115 points lower, s&p 500 also would be off as would the nasdaq. we are getting earnings news, mr. kernen. >> adjusted 1.06 in line with expectations. revenue came in, domestic package revenue 7.86 billion international package revenue of 2.9 billion. i'm not sure how that breaks out for what the street had been anticipating for this.

these numbers are really justity hitting. >> 4.55 to 4.65 for the year. that's fine, because 4.56 is the estimate. average volume domestic was up 13.2 million versus 12.74, packages and the actual number that's a pretty good thing to look at. however, international package average volume per day, 2.3 versus 2.34, down a little. the revenue number 13.07 billion is below the 13.31 billion that, in this case thompson reuters ibes was looking for. that is a little bit shy of expectations on the revenue side. i want to see once again year over year. i can't imagine u.p.s. would have revenue, unless it's because of forex. consolidated revenue is down

13.17 from a year ago period, 13.17 and 13.07 so once again down. >> the company sounds or the chairman and ceo scott davis sounds like they're happy, they say results were achieved and it highlights the flexibility of our business model, illustrates the breadth of the u.p.s. product portfolio and meeting needs of its customers and it was achieved in an environment of slowing and changing market dynamics. you continue to hear these words again and again in every single one of the releases, the environment of slowing global trade is something we've been watching for with fedex and u.p.s. >> and the magnitude of the holiday shopping season. this is a transport, not an industrial but at this point it looks like it could trade higher but that won't help the industrial average. you got to, they barely hit and they probably had been maybe a little bit of i don't know if they lowered expectations, but everybody knew -- >> fedex. >> right and fedex, too. so they barely hit the 1.06

which was lower and the revenue was below expectations so that's not going to cause you to say, well, that's different than dupont and 3m. it's not much better. >> they point out the international segment produced an operating profit of 449 million, that was the highest third quarter ever so strength they saw internationally relative to what we've been seeing in the global slowdown. we will continue to watch the earnings as they come in and when we come back we have a preview of apple's ipod mini, they have earnings tomorrow, it's your money and the i-comony. tomorrow a special "squawk box" event, warren buffett on the economy, the election and avoiding the fiscal cliff. two hours with one of the world's richest men, buffett, "squawk box," tomorrow, starting at 7:00 a.m. eastern, rise above.

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welcome back to "squawk box." apple gearing up for another major product announcement, it's widely expected to be a smaller version of the ipad, call it the ipad mini. we go to jon fortt in silicon valley for more on today's main event. >> reporter: right behind me is where the action will take place. we're expecting a mini ipad. apple hasn't said exactly what this is.

what would be the big deal over a smaller ipad? this would be the biggest new product announcement in about almost the past three years. not in the sense that it's bigger revenue wise, probably than an iphone but in terms of a new design and a risk apple is taking, a smaller ipad would be part of that. steve jobs said he wasn't in favor of such a thing at seven inches. of course we expect this could be closer to eight inches than seven based on a lot of the buzz out there. we have to wait and see. you could take a look at the products that apple has put out over the past few years as you've seen the stock do this amazing run since the iphone, this would be another product on that line-up so a question, will this be like another mac mini which close less than the mainstream imac but helped to bolster apple's overall product line or the ipod nano which outsold ipods before it.

key questions for today, how much will it cost, when will it go on sale, how sharp is the display, and how much would wireless cost if this hooks up to broader wireless networks? guys, we don't know. i'll bring you all the news as it happens in there later today. back to you. >> thanks, jon, we'll stick with you as the day progresses. joining us to talk about this the analyst who coined the term ipad mini, the first to uncover the new product was in the works and joining us now is brian white, analyst at topeka capital markets. good morning to you. >> good morning. >> what is your sense of how big a market there is for an ipad mini and how much might canni l cannibalize the traditional ipad market? >> you know, i think ultimately this can be bigger than the ipad market, so when you take a look at fiscal '13 we're looking at about 84 million ipads. i don't think ipad mini will surpass the ipad in the first year, but i do think when we look out two to three years down the road, i think this is a

bigger market opportunity for apple. >> is this a higher margin product, a lower margin product for them in. >> it's a good question. it should be slightly lower margin versus what they're getting from the ipad, so we estimate probably 300, 400 basis points lower, and i would remind you, this is not, this will not be a low-end product. we just went to asia. we held one of the pilot ipads minis and i think what you're going to see is actually the casing will be much more refined, smoother, and actually have a better look than the current ipad. so this is going to be a smaller form factor, lower cost, but still a luxury good. >> brian, i don't know if you saw it but across the tape earlier today the government actually dropping or at least one agency in the government dropping about 17,000 blackberries in favor of iphones. is the ipad or the ipad mini, does that ever become part of an

enterprise purchase? >> you know i think ultimately it will. today if you look at the tablet market, about 90% is consumer, about 10% is enterprise, but i think ultimately that's going to drive significantly higher, and apple certainly wants to be a part, so if you look at the numbers they talk about, 95% of the fortune 500 are deploying or testing the ipad and same with the iphone. you bring up a great point. this is an untapped area for apple on the iphone side and the ipad side the tablet market hasn't adopted the tablet so there is significant opportunity there. >> why are you bullish on an ipad mini when you look at the smaller devices google has done, the nexus and kindle fire, they really have not sold in big numbers. >> you're exactly right. well these are inferior products. they're not good products. i've played with them. they don't have the ecosystem apple has, don't have the design

quality, they don't put the quality material in there. i think we'll see that in ipad mini and this will open up the lower price point. this lower price point, smaller ipad market, what does it mean? number one, education. this is a huge opportunity for apple with a smaller ipad for kids and school. number two, developing countries, china bought 2.6 million tablets june quarter. china is going to go gaga over the ipad mini. third is lower priced product. >> brian thank you for joining us this morning. cnbc will have complete coverage of apple's main event including the product rollout later today. up next senator john kerry will join us to talk politics and the economy. take a look at the futures right now, the dow is down by triple digits, the s&p is off by 14.5 points, this is coming as we sift through this morning's earnings news. started off with dupont this morning but we have had more bad news since then and the markets seem to be moving on this.

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>> cannot triple assistanted make it through. >> you can't triple stamp a double stamp, lloyd. >> we'll rise above the rhetoric, an assessment of the foreign policy debate from the chairman of the senate foreign relations committee, senator john kerry. senator rand paul on out of control government regulation, and campaign strategy in the final two weeks before the election. plus a grammy award winning musician joining us on set, blues traveler's john popper on the latest trends in the music industry and the business climate for entertainers. the third hour of "squawk box" right now. ♪ i lied and told her i loved her ♪ ♪ she didn't care but anyway welcome back to "squawk box" on cnbc, first in business worldwide. i'm becky quick with joe kernen and andrew ross sorkin. our guest today is democratic

strategist joe shrum. senator john kerry was responsible for walking the president through all of these debates and helping him prep for them, plus we'll be joint by cftc commissioner gary gensler, weighing in on regulatory reform and futures markets. kentucky senator rand paul will talk about the final two weeks of the presidential campaign, the responsibility of elected officials and his new book "government bullies" and capping off the morning with john popper, front man of the grammy winning band blues traveler, has thoughts about the business of the music industry and political thoughts as well. >> a look at the markets which are probably the main story this morning, even though we did have a debate, but yeah, 3m and dupont, the big multinationals continue to report results that the street is not satisfied with, in spite of a lot of these companies not being that positive going into the season and yet they're still negative

enough to cause people to take a step back and say wow, this is a little bit surprising globally that growth is this slow and in both dupont and 3m's case it had to do with lower revenue even though it's forex related. >> is this where the market was fooling it self? i don't know what they could possibly be seeing. you've known for a long time about the economy. >> we've been talking about kashkari has mentioned it, el erian mentioned it, the actual fundamentals underpinning the stock prices and whether there is a gap that needs to either be worked out over time or whether it's an air pocket and we'll see. we continue to trade not that far from four and five-year highs but certainly business is not great. and as joe mentioned -- >> as joe mentioned some major companies reported earlier this morning. u.p.s. posted third quarter earnings of $1.06 a share, that

was in line with consensus, revenues fell a bit below. the company warning full year profits of three-mm profits will fall sort of consensus. dupont two cents shy of expectations, 7.4 billion was short of expectations. dupont pointing to shortfalls in its paint and solar panel segments. >> both companies lower than expect the revenue and lower revenue from last year. >> and lower estimate going forward. >> yes, and lower estimates. >> and united technologies reporting profit of $1.37 a share, above estimates of $1.18, much of the beat from a less than expected delusion from its acquisition of goodrich so i don't know how you take that. >> but speaking of qep, qe

perpetual, among other stories we're following, fed policy makers begin a two-day meeting with the fomc's latest policy statement set for tomorrow afternoon. unlike last time around when a new round of faunttative easing was announced this meet something expected to be far less eventful. there's interesting things happening in the markets as kevin ferry pointed out a lot of things are down. >> money disappeared, not sure whether it went. >> money heaven or cash or somewhere else. another closely watched -- >> you were raised catholic. >> i don't think money goes to heaven, people go to heaven. >> that's right. >> maybe the republican view money goes to heaven. >> democrats believe people who have money have a harder time going to heaven. >> it's easier for a rich man to -- the eye of the needle than a camel to pass through the eye of the needle. >> but it was the gate -- >> "jerusalem. >> don't throw the biblical crap

at me shrum. i went to jesuit school. >> i went to jesuit college. >> okay, that beats me. i'm going to jug you. >> justice under god. detention after school. >> that's right. and another closely watched meeting today apple hosting a special event at 1:00 p.m. eastern, the company expected to unveil a smaller version of the ipad called the mini pad and i'm not going to say anything about whether they'll introduce a maxipad. i've used that joke a couple of times. they're going smaller, no reason to go bigger because you have a laptop and there is utility in going small. >> as a woman, this appeals to me because you can sick it in your purse, not as heavy. >> or in my murse or fanny pack. >> don't say fanny. please don't. >> one day they will have a maxipad version of this. >> please keep going. there must be some management intervention or something. >> sorry.

analysts and tech experts are calling it the ipad mini, although the real name is not known yet. industry experts say the new device will be about half the size of the original ipad but slightly larger than the kindle fire and the google nexus. as for prize, most of the guesses range from 249 to 299 and cnbc will bring you coverage of the event throughout the day. president obama and mitt romney sparring over foreign policy in last night's final debate in boca raton, florida. >> i look around the world, i don't see our influence growing around the world. i see our influence receding, in part because of the failure of the president to deal with our economic challenges at home. >> what the american people understand is, is that i look at what we need to get done to keep the american people safe and to move our interests forward and i make those decisions. >> joining us right now is senator john kerry, the chairman of the senate foreign relations committee and also responsible for helping prepare the

president for last night's debate. senator kerry thank you for joining us today. >> i'm delighted to be with you and especially with my debate coach, bob shrum. >> of course. >> thank you, hi, john. >> and senator, we're looking at this, two weeks left, a lot of people looked at the debates last night and the snap polls i saw put this in the president's camp for a win for him but as you know very well, you get through these debates as you did back in 2004, this is two weeks, this is a flat out run so what happens now? what's the sense for the candidates at this point and what's the sense of urgency and relief from getting through the debates? >> i think that last night, frankly, was very, very important, because it really crystallized to america as they think about who should be commander in chief and who should lead our nation for the next four years that what you saw last night was the comparison between a commander in chief and a campaigner in

confusion. mitt romney came into that debate last night, two weeks before an election and basically said everything i've been saying for the last seven years isn't true or i'm hiding my true positions, and so you know he said the president's doing a good job on iran. he didn't have one thing different to say about how he'd stop him from having nuclear weapons even though for months he's been saying he has a better plan, libya, the same thing, afghanistan. last night he actually came in, having been campaigning saying he wouldn't have set a date he came in and set a firm date. i mean nobody in america can have confidence that they know where mitt romney would be as commander in chief. and the fact is that president -- even on the military, he talks about numbers of ships. that's not how you make a judgment about how strong you are. you make it what is your capacity and ability to do things. the. the is building ships. everybody in virginia should listen carefully. nine ships a year, and the president is taking it up to the

328 level that the leaders of the navy believe we ought to have. so i believe last night you saw a dramatic difference, not just on foreign policy but on the economy, where most of the listeners here ought to stop and take note. mitt romney has signed the grover norquist lobbyist pledge not to raise any revenue at all. now that's been the recipe for gridlock in washington. >> that's not been what governor obama -- sorry, what governor romney has talked about in these debates himself, in the first debate he laid out -- >> excuse me, excuse me, mitt romney, you go please check. all across the nation he signed the pledge, grover norquist will tell you he signed the pledge. he ran in the primaries bragging to everybody that he will not raise revenue. he said in the debate he would not accept 10:1 cuts to revenue, and in fact he reinforced that in the debate with president obama so what are you talking about? >> he said that he would not

lower rates on wealthier people. >> but it's right. no net increase in revenue on people. >> he will not raise revenue, which is what simpson-bowles, rivlin-domenici and the gang of six in the senate agreed. >> neither side has picked it up, the frustration that a plan like bowles-simpson has not put forth. >> not true. >> how so? >> i served on the supercommittee, i know this, i know exactly what stopped that committee from being able to get a deal. >> which one? >> we had major transformation in entitlements, a major proposal from 1.3 trillion to 600 to 300 billion. they wouldn't even agree to $300 billion of revenue so it was impossible to get an agreement because they were terrified of grover forquist the lobbyist who might run somebody against them in the primary.

i'm telling you the truth that's what happened. >> i thought between the end it was between boehner and president and they were close to a deal. there are different sides on what happened. i thought they had an agreement in principle. >> there's only one truth. they had an agreement. >> so he didn't come back for another 400 billion. i mean, this gets -- we have guys from the other side that just tell us their version of the truth, too, and we get nowhere. we heard he came back for another 400 billion and that's when he blinked. >> i disagree. what happened was john boehner came under attack from eric cantor and the tea party in the house, and he was threatened to lose his speakership, and he backed off the deal. >> and republicans say the president met with nancy pelosi and the democrats and that he could not deliver on the entitlement cuts. that's what the other side says. >> my guess is both sides would have trouble. >> just to have it definitively thrown out -- >> can i go back to the -- >> i understand -- you guys want to debate among yourselves. >> no, i think you're right but

can i go back to the debate? what i was stunned by, senator, was the constant repetition from romney and i wrote it down, i agree i support. let me underscore the president's position. you played romney in the run-up to this in the practice debates. did you anticipate that he would show up and walk away from all his positions, walk away from libya, walk away from what he'd said on syria that for example the president would dominate the debate in terms of israel? >> i found i was stunned by last night. there was no way in your greatest imagination to practice a mitt romney who agrees with everything the president has said when he's been running on the opposite for months. look i ran for president of the united states. i happen to believe when you run for president what you say to the american people matters. evidently mitt romney doesn't believe that. you can say anything. you can etch-a-sketch your way to the presidency. he came in last night with cliff notes foreign policy. he had sort of a wikipedia

approach to name a few places, say the taliban are in pakistan, talk about mali and the al qaeda there but didn't have policy recipes that were different and didn't have policy recipes so he agrees with the president. i think it was a shocking display and i think that's why americans overwhelmingly said we have a commander in chief who understands how to get the job done and this is not the time to change. >> senator, there was one remark that the president made that has some people raising eyebrows today. he would not allow the sequester to happen, and the white house has tried to suggest that he was not making news but a lot of other people confused because it sounded like news. >> i think the president has made it clear that he wants to solve the deficit problem. he has been willing to compromise. the president as you recall made many offers with john boehner to change entitlements. i will tell you that we had that discussion on the supercommittee and we made many, many proffers. we actually offered a $1.2

trillion deal to the other folks with the same amount of money and revenue that senator toomey had offered in his proposal, the $400 billion. guess what? they turned it down. so all i can say to you is the president is prepared to compromise, but if you come into this discussion having promised the nation you won't take revenue, you are either lying to your base or you're not telling the truth to the american people. it's one or the other. you're either going to compromise in which case you faked it with the right, and how you got the nomination or you're not going to compromise, which is the recipe for disaster for the next four years. you know the president has put a $4 trillion deal on the table and it had very tough choices. it raised the age to 67 for retirement, medicare retirement. it did things people didn't like but that's leadership and what we saw was, it wasn't met on the other side. >> senator kerry, thank you very much for your time today. >> thank you.

okay, coming up, he is the chairman of the cftc, tasked with regulating and proekt itting the futures market, gary gensler on industry reform and restoring investor confidence, when we return. from 17 billion chips worldwide

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welcome back to "squawk box." futures -- you had such promise but then you went to harvard. that's what happened. >> so did mitt romney. how did he survive? >> down 130 points almost. it is it an ugly session, which comes after a pretty ugly week last week. yesterday was okay, but this is back to business as usual with dow components and other companies reporting disappointing results, maybe earnings were okay, maybe earnings were in line with expectations but revenue was not only below last year but below expectations at both 3m and dupont and as a result we'll have a rocky session and i don't like these sessions, andrew, when you start out down 129, you

know, just seems like somehow you look up in the middle of the day and you're down 200 and then who knows at this point. i don't like october. >> like taking points away before the game starts. >> october 23rd. >> october 23rd. >> october is -- >> two weeks away from the other big day. >> is that really coming? i want an extension, i told thaw. i made my mind up, can't make my mind up, i need a few more debates. >> we have two more weeks to debate it here. sifma is going on in new york city and cnbc's mary thompson is standing by with a top regulator speaking at the event. who is your special guest? >> my special guest is gary gensler who reports as the chairman of the cftc. thanks for joining us. >> so good to be with you mary. >> pretty important month october 12th you began the registration for swap dealers. what does this mean for

investors? >> it means this vast market the swaps market is coming under some of the similar forms that the securities and futures market had since the 1930s. it's going to bring transparency in the markets and ultimately i think lower costs to investors as there's more competition in these markets. >> that being said, there's already been some pushbacks specifically from some of the foreign banks who would have to register if they want to do business with u.s. banks, just today in the "wall street journal" there's a bank in sweden and singapore saying they're not going to do it. how do you make sure the foreign banks are in line with the u.s. banks so all the regulation has a level playing field? >> well, i like your word level playing field. it's critical whether it's a foreign or u.s. bank dealing with u.s. persons enough business that it's a level playing field. we wouldn't want to regulate just the u.s. banks and have the foreign banks here in the u.s. not come under that, those rules and in terms of the two banks that were not registering, our goal was to get the largest

banks in the swap business and i don't think those two banks were. >> i want to talk about another story that's in the paper today talking about how goldman is looking at exiting the commodities business, comes on the heels of a report by kate kelly because of new regulations that are coming down. if you have the two banks exit the commodities business what does it mean for the markets? >> the markets are vibrant and energy and agricultural have many non-financial entities that trade and hedge in those markets. so i think it will continue to be a vibrant market but if those banks were to depart that i assume others would take the lead and provide liquidity in those markets. >> we only have a minute left so a couple quick questions i want to ask you. first of all, let's talk about this being the one-year anniversary of mf global. is the fftc said to bring any civil charges? no charges have been filed no,

fines issued, et cetera. what is the cftc's plan. >> a year ago it turned into an enforcement action which would have involved jon corzine as a former partner so i'm not involved. what we've done as an agency is to enhance customer protection. we've made sure that customer money can no longer be lent to the rest of the firm, a rule we passed last december and just yesterday we put out more rules to enhance customer protection. we need to enhance customer protection further. >> i want to get to one more question, sorry for cutting you off but back in april the cftc filed charges against barclay for manipulating libor. awe lewded to three other banks but didn't name them. can we expect charges to be filed against these banks and if so when? >> it's critical benchmarks be honest and reliable and the markets can rely on these and

the market cannot have folks attempting to manipulate or game the market. >> that's fine, are you going to file charges against the other three banks and if so when? >> i can't speak to other matters but the cftc will ensure the markets work for the american public. >> gary thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> we've gun speaking with gary gensler, the chairman of the cftc, back to you. >> thanks for that. coming up futures are trading sharply lower this morning after some disappointing results from some dow components. we'll have more on today's disappointing earnings reports, still to come, and andrew reporting in his column that fed chairman ben bernanke is, he wants out of there. i thought we knew that. unlikely to seek a third term. more on that and who might replace him, next. bob...

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up next we'll get to kentucky senator rand paul. we'll have his take on last night's debate and talk strategy for the final two weeks of the presidential campaign. and his band won a grammy for the song you're listening to now, blues traveler. front man john popper is getting ready in the green room, we'll ask him about trends in the music business and andrew's column whether or not ben bernanke is staying and who would replace him.

welcome back to "squawk box." my column in the new york times, a couple of wires picking up a piece of this who may take over the treasury and fed position it is unlikely ben bernanke stays in his position even if obama wins, not to say he's leaving

after the election, just to suggest he would likely leave in january of 2014, frankly no matter who is elected. he began his role in 2006, so he would be in the job for about eight years. steve liesman is right here, you've got some views on all of this. i didn't think we were making huge news on this. he's told a number of friends that he's -- >> this say bit of reporting that adds to the discussion. i don't think there's an expectation that bernanke would stay for a third term. i've said it a bunch of times through my knowledge and i don't think that's news, but if you talk to a bunch of his buddies -- >> most of his buddies will tell you he didn't plan a staying and it's interesting to me in the context of you have to replace geithner literally in the next three or four months by the way no matter who wins again and then within 15 months you have to replace bernanke. >> the same thing you added -- >> you think it's news?

your column, sourcing sorkin bernanke saying this. >> yes. >> bernanke is not saying this. >> bernanke has told friends over the past couple months if not longer that he would like to move on after the second term. >> two things, the notion that they want geithner to move over to be fed chairman, this notion. >> inside the administration, to the extent that obama wins, there is a view and i think it's a dark horse, long shot, that you let geithner out, give him a year to sort of cool down, he makes some money, does the speaking circuit, and then when bernanke leaves you put him in the slot, and that would offer some continuity. whether you can actually get that to happen, whether he wants to go back to washington may be unlikely. >> i know that geithner wants a break. he's clearly wanted a break for a while. i know that from talking to his friends that geithner is ready for a break. >> the question is -- >> has wanted it for awhile. >> -- whether he would come back. most interesting was erskine

bowles. we always talk about him in the context as a potential obama appointee for the treasury secretary. i'm told that he has gotten a little bit on the bad side of the president post over the past couple months as he's talked to the business community privately he's criticized the president. >> i asked him i don't know if it was on or off camera. >> it wasn't on. go ahead and tell us because i watched that interview. >> he didn't want it, that was the impression i got having spoken to him. >> i heard from republican supporters of romney who said you want to hear an interesting idea and we proposed this either directly to romney or to his team saying you should put bowles, that would actually be an interesting, clever way to say i'm going to reach across the aisle and play ball. >> i've then in erskine for a long time. >> you think he would take the job under romney? >> certainly not with romney giving him undertakings on taxes romney can't give him. erskine believes you have to do

this in a balanced way w entitlement reform and tax increases at the top. >> steve raised if i can say it during the commercial break, i think more intriguing idea not on the column. >> that's really the question that's out there. >> would bernanke resign if romney were to win? >> let me tell you what i've heard on that score, people have said that they don't want him to resign if romney becomes president, that they think it's bad for the institution. >> that presupposes this is something he's already considering. >> i can't say if that's been considered, but i know that people have said there's some concern that that could happen. in the case of a president who has openly and publicly opposed the fed chairman that it's something that might be considered, and they have said that something you should talk about, that this notion that he shouldn't do that. >> there's a reason that the fed chairman's term is not concurrent with the presidential election cycle. >> steve, don't you think for

all romney's campaign rhetoric, given the condition of the economy and what has to be done he'd actually prefer that bernanke stay around? >> in other words, as a foil? >> as someone who will try to keep this thing moving along. romney had to buy into the fed stuff. >> i don't agree. if romney becomes president, you know, and then there are some appointments to be had on the board of governors, that you have to start thinking about whether or not there would be a change in policy. >> i think that's right, but for the immediate future, if bernanke resigned you could throw the markets under turmoil, it could be a difficult situation. >> let me ask you one question. we have to tease something that you're working on today. is it possible that bernanke stays on the board but steps down from the role? >> actually that is technically possible. >> technically possible. until 2020. he can stay on the board until 2020 technically. >> it's never happened but he does have a governorship that runs over the 14-year period, not necessarily a chairmanship.

those are separate things. very quick lly folks, the fed i talking today, they have a meeting today and tomorrow but i don't think it's a time for deciding things. it's a time for discussing very important issues for the market. i believe it will be december when they start to decide these things, but between now and then we're going to get the minutes. if we have that full screen, here's what they need to talk about. i can't read it because it's too far away but i know there's a thing called the treasury cliff, or i'm calling it the treasury cliff when operation twist ends. what do they do in january, what else is on there? the calendar, numerical tarkget. many members don't like the date guidance and market expectations how to calibrate qe expectations with economic data. that's not been spelled out, since we are in the infinity or perpetual qe. how much qe versus what the data might say. other things on their mind is the global weakness and they'll be interested in the earnings outlook and the market reaction and some of the questions i'll

have a chance to put to today. >> do you drive a car? >> do? i. >> you can't see diddly. you droo i have a car? >> joe, look at that. >> you drive a car? >> i drive a car. >> you don't have contact lenses? >> i don't need. >> that is not that far. >> that is far away and very -- can we get a shot of what i'm supposed to read? >> i can read that ease pill. >> put some words on that. >> i can read the ticker. >> all of us have the same issue. >> and you complain about it. becky's like 40 years younger than i am. >> we behaved ourselves in high school. >> i'll ask all of these questions of alan greenspan later today at the cifma conference and we'll be doing all of that, four fingers, three fingers like from "my cousin vinny." breaking news, target announcing it has reached agreement to sell its credit card polio to td bank t has a gross value of about $5.9 billion and by the way target is

one of the few stocks that is trading higher in the premarket, up by 1.5%, all of the other stocks have been affected by the earnings, malaise, and some of the bad news this morning. a united states senator who says government is out of control in his new book "kentucky senator" rand paul outlines the bloating of the federal government, the book is "government bullies: how everyday americans are being harassed, abused and imprisoned by the feds." senator paul joins us now, our guest host continues, democratic strategist bob shrum is with us as well. senator, yesterday it got a lot of play on a lot of different websites, we had mark farber on. he thinks 50% of the government should be cut immediately just to try to get us back on the course to financial stability. that's obviously not going to be possible, but what if we were to just freeze the government, is that something we could look at? >> well the interesting thing is if you freeze spending, the pundits in washington will call

that a $9 trillion cut over ten years. so you remember how everybody was talking about to be credible you need to cut at least $4 trillion. that's $4 trillion from proposed increases so a freeze is scored by cbo as a $9 trillion cut over ten years but it would balance the budget. i think it's simple enough for everyone to grasp and i personally think it would be a great idea, or i'm also in favor of a penny plan, which would cut 1% but a real cut of 1% each year for six years, and it balances in the seventh or eighth year. >> senator, and bob shrum is here, if we were to combine freezing the government with raising taxes somewhere, i'm not sure how, where bob wants to raise them but raising them i guess on the high end, that's what we usually hear, could we do it more quickly and is that something that you would agree to, to get the freeze? >> only if you want negative economic growth. you can have a balanced budget, no economic growth, but i

wouldn't be in favor of that. the only way to stimulate the economy and get the economy growing is to leave more money in the hands of those who earn it so i'm a big fan of tax cuts, not revenue neutral tax cuts, tax cuts that leave more money in kentucky, more money in ohio. really that's the only way you can stimulate the economy. you need to grow the private sector, which means you need to shrink the public sector so i don't want more money in washington. i want a smaller budget, and i want it balanced with a smaller number. i don't want to balance a $3.8 trillion budget. i want to balance it with what the revenue that comes in, about $2.2 trillion currently. >> look, senator, bob shrum here. during the 1990s under both clinton we had marginally higher tax rates, created 23 million jobs, under george w. bush we had a cut in the tax rates, we had big deficits, we had virtually no net job creation. why should we believe that this model of cutting taxes and giving big tax breaks to people at the top not all that many of

whom by the way live in kentucky will create a lot more jobs in this country when the record suggests that's not the case? >> i think the two biggest examples of when cutting tax rates for everyone, including the 1% have worked to lower unemployment would be kennedy in the '60s and reagan again in the early 1980s. some of the growth we were having in the '90s i think was leftover personally from lowering the top rate from 70 to 50 and lowering it again from 50 to 28, so i think the tax policies that reagan instituted carried forward and gave us a decade of growth. the other thing is, is that i look at it the which milton friedman looked at it. nobody spends somebody else's money as wisely as they spend their own so any money given to government is given to the inefficient sector. we have to have government but we should minimize how much money government has, because they're inherently incapable of doing things wisely with the money. >> senator, i'm going to, i got

this dvr, i'm going to replay that to myself a couple of times. >> i disagree with it but we're running out of time. >> senator rand paul thanks for your time today. i love kentucky. i grew up in cincinnati looking over. plenty of wealthy people in kentucky, thank you. >> actually the median income in kentucky is somewhat below the national average. >> he's looking down on it now. >> no, i want those people to rise up and the way they do it is we invest in the middle class not tax giveaways to the wealthy. >> we want trickle-down government. >> no, build from the middle class up. when we come back you'll recognize his voice and march monica. ♪ john popper is the grammy award winning front man of the band blues traveler. ♪ >> so cool. >> he's going to join us on set right after this. ♪

welcome back to "squawk box" this morning. the futures right now, we're starting the day behind the ball, if you will, down 141 points if we opened up right now and we have a little bit of music to give us a pick-me-up. >> if you're worried about the arrows, all morning long we're playing blues traveler, latest album is "susy cracks the whip"

the band burst onto the scenes in the '90s, you know the songs and more importantly you know the harmonica sounds, too. joining us on the "squawk" stage is john popper, lead singer of blues traveler, harmonica expert and john you brought us harmonicas. >> i gave you guys each a harmonica so you could work in harmony and in concert, and after just coming out of commercial break i realized the folly of my ways. but let's tall try again, inhale at the same time, one, two, three. ♪ and exhale. i'm instantly sympathizing with music teachers around the nation. but you know the fun thing about harmonicas is they in theory never go out of tune. sounds like that one is, just a little. >> maybe he's out of tune. >> it could be me. >> i point out the harmonicas were all made in china.

>> by bain industries. >> shrum immediately says by bain, oh, that he's just -- >> i have to say i was watching earlier today your breakdown of the debate was spot-on. >> thank you. >> i thought you had it down. i think he was playing a defensive game and he was kind of sweating, but you know what i saw last night was two candidates who didn't want to be there. both of them were like, don't mess this up. oh, god, and like i think there's just an incredible amount of fatigue at this point. >> i asked for an extension because i'm not ready. >> he wants more debates. >> take another year. >> another year, another 2 billion. we're going to do this. >> decision 5,000. >> 47 minutes on each side, 6%, make up your mind! >> then president for sure for another year. >> i love "american idol" we should have feats of strength, grievances whatnot. >> people judge the debates no

longer as what is this guy going to do to me in my life but almost in the era of reality tv they judge them as a contest and the old mcclewen line you have to be cool is repealed. >> we've gone way beyond that into what's that, the boyle woman. >> susan boyle. >> yes, now we want to see that kind of moment now. i think she could actually win in a write-in if she was running. >> you're an interesting guy for a musician, you're a libertarian. >> i'm a libertarian but i went to a libertarian rally and i really believe in just about everything they say with two exceptions. i think we can't be isolationists and you can't dabble in world politics for you know however long, 250 years and then just sort of, we're kidding, you can't just stop, and that's a problem for me, and then also i'm pro-choice, and i

think as a libertarian, it should at least be open to that question, and ron paul, you know, god bless him, is very pro-life, and that's his party is very behind him on that, and that's something that i have a problem with, but again, the great thing about being a libertarian they don't have to agree with each other. at that rally i was very aware of a very big pro-life swell and again that's how people feel about it but it's just that's the issue i have with it. >> you're on the road what is it about 250 days out of the year? >> yeah. it certainly feels like that now, pretty close to that, doing about six months this year. >> you're talking to people across america all the tile. what's the sense you get from talking to people about how they feel not only about politics, but about the economy right now? >> i think the economy is really the issue right now. great way to look at it is in that first debate i believed

romney about the economy. i wanted to believeobama, and that to me was the difference. he was talking about education, he was talking about helping people, and i wanted that to be true, and romney said i can make the economy better and you're like, i think can he make the economy better, and that was really write came out on it, and that's where i think a lot of people came out on it, and whether or not this was an intended bounce back for romney, i don't know, but i just know that this was a real bounce back, and i like the fact that it's close. whoever wins at this point, i'm going othito think they fairly earned it. i didn't like one side being of course we should win. >> you're going to have a very divided population. there's going to be about half the country that thinks -- >> hasn't it been that way anyway, it's been divided since bush/gore since someone stole the election or someone didn't steal the election. >> you're absolutely right about

this. 2000 we were a 50/50 country, 2004 we were a 50/50 country. that was distorted in 2008 which the financial collapse. myself the president is going to win in the end and he has a structural advantage in the battleground states and will win by a reasonable but not very big margin of the popular vote but it's going to be close. does the congress if it's still republican, decide that it has to cooperate and come somewhere to the middle? >> i think the financial cliff is going to force everyone to compromise. this election should really just be the referendum on cooperation. i'm hoping it will be. i think everyone is hoping that. it is an unpopular congress. basically for the entire length since 2000, there's been this phrase that's been very popular that peeves me off. i know we're on television. he's not my president. people love to say that.

no matter who wins, that's going to be your president. obama is our president now. and bush was our president and both of these people are co-conspirators in this incredible deficit and in our military adventures. you can say that one isn't responsible and one is. they've also inherited this from clinton. you can take it back to eisenhower. you can blame everything on the paris treaty in 1919 if you really want to. >> you can blame a lot on it. >> you can. >> do you think we can blame the french? >> that's where new world order was established. you can blame cane and able if you want to. we're in it now. whoever wins that race is going to be our president. >> stay with us. coming up, we have more futures trading sharply lower on negative earnings as we get jim cramer's take on dupont and 3m next.

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welcome to the world leader in derivatives. welcome to superderivatives. welcome back. let's get down to the new york stock exchange. a lot of numbers this morning, jim? >> ellen coleman will not replace ben bernanke. the dupont numbers at this point. when i go over the quarter, i

feel like it is the quarter of the day. my travel chest owns it. i thought this was one of the situations where dividend would protect it. yield is 3.5. i have to tell you, 3m was not as bad as people thought. operating margins were good. not great sales but it's not as disastrous as futures would indicate but at the same time feels like there needs to be a repeal of the afternoon rally. the dow looks like it was greatly mistaken. >> what caused dupont there? did you look closely? >> i did. frankly the division i thought would be good would be safety. they cited government spending as being disappointed. the reason i say that is 3m safety division wasn't that bad. the ceo has been on "squawk." talked a good game. the ceo has divested the company

of some of the more cyclical aspects. you have to hear the call. the actual presentation left way too many questions unanswered. i do think that it's a better company than it used to be. i am surprised of the shortfall that was so painful for this economy. >> everything from sunscreen to paint. >> toothpaste this morning. used it. becky, i got to tell you. i know you have the big interview. insurance stocks are so hot. insurance, housing and the rail part of berkshire should be good. it will define a lot more about the market than we've heard this morning. >> we'll ask all of those questions. thank you very much. >> great to see you guys. >> when we come back, the last word from blues traveler front man. [ horn honks ] hey, it's sandra -- from accounting. peter.

i can see that you're busy... but you were gonna help us crunch the numbers for accounts receivable today. i mean i know that this is important. well, both are important. let's be clear. they are but this is important too. [ man ] the receivables. [ male announcer ] michelin knows it's better for xerox to help manage their finance processing. so they can focus on keeping the world moving. with xerox, you're ready for real ness.

>> our thanks to bob for joining us today. we'll give john the last word. he's front man for blues traveler. last word is apple. >> i think it ultimately is good as long as you can figure out how to make money off of it. >> you have or you ve